Lake Breeze alcohol tank busted

[David Kilnapp]

Hello friends. I was demonstrating my Lake Breeze (see below) today to my sister and law. When I put the fan over the tank, one of the seams ruptured and flaming alcohol spilled all over the place. Fortunately, my Lake Breeze is in my cellar so nothing was damaged including the fan. I had a heckuva time putting the alcohol fire out. I need to bring one of my fire extinquishers down to that work area. Probably a good idea. Anyway, I seem to remember that someone (maybe Dave Dimitrion in FLA) knew someone who made copper tanks for thse fans. I've sent Dave a FB private message and am awaiting his reply. I suppose I could have my tank repaired but it's pretty flimsy tin and I don't trust it now. Who in the club makes these tanks?

[Robert Grove]

Dave is the Guy 

[David Kilnapp]

The tank actually blew up and the bottom blew out. I've lit the thing hundreds of times without incident. It's a mystery as to why this happened.

[Lane Shirey]

Get a small sterno can and use it instead. Much safer. I used to use Sterno before I sold mine. 

[Paul Michael]

Glad there was no real damage!

Can anyone chime in? That does not look like the original tanks I know, the top shoulder is turned, not seamed! But that's on the copper tanks; is yours tinned steel? I believe both styles were made. 🤔

[Brent Rowell]

It's not surprising to me that this tank eventually blew up. You may already know this, but it's a reproduction and made without the all-important air vent. ALL alcohol burners should have a vent or this will eventually happen. You can see the vent in the photo of this original Lake Breeze alcohol burner (red arrows). They're perfectly safe as long as properly vented and not overfilled; if you get another repro tank make sure it has this feature. Also, never burn alcohol in a burner designed for kerosene--just ask Terry Fisher what happens.

[Paul Michael]

6 hours ago, Brent Rowell said:

It's not surprising to me that this tank eventually blew up. You may already know this, but it's a reproduction and made without the all-important air vent. ALL alcohol burners should have a vent or this will eventually happen. You can see the vent in the photo of this original Lake Breeze alcohol burner (red arrows). They're perfectly safe as long as properly vented and not overfilled; if you get another repro tank make sure it has this feature. Also, never burn alcohol in a burner designed for kerosene--just ask Terry Fisher what happens.

BUT THE AIR VENT IS VISIBLE in David's photo!

[Russ Huber]

6 hours ago, Brent Rowell said:

 it's a reproduction.

BUT THE AIR VENT IS VISIBLE in David's photo!

I was online at the time of David's post and emailed Brent to please help David based on Brent's extensive knowledge on these types of fans. I am no authority on hot air fans. The fact it is a reproduction speaks for itself based on the quality of the reproduction.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Russ Huber

[Russ Huber]

Not only does Brent Rowell have very extensive knowledgeable about these hot air motors and fans, but his years of experience can also spot a fake that would more than likely fool me and others. He dropped membership a while back as I understood him based on for most part due to the lack of interest in his hot air engines and fans. Makes sense to me. How many of you post hot air fans with frequency?  On top of that, Brent is fair.

 

[Steve Stephens]

56 minutes ago, Russ Huber said:

(Brent Rowell) dropped membership a while back as I understood him based on for most part due to the lack of interest in his hot air engines and fans. Makes sense to me. How many of you post hot air fans with frequency?  On top of that, Brent is fair.

 

I remember speaking with Brent on several occasions to gather more knowledge on hot air engines.   he had posted a number of excellent videos of various makes of hot air and Sterling engine fans or motors.   I don't think that many people have access or own these wonderful fans and engines so it's no wonder many never post about them.

 

Brent, I have an original Lake Breeze just like David's.  At a Fanfair when I had my 16" Lake Breeze along with a number of other such fans, mostly Terry Fishers, we were running them when my alcohol tank blew up and singed Terrys' eyebrows.   No other damage but my font has a stretched bottom now.  I later learned that the tiny vent pipe was missing on my font but a tiny hole was near the cap where the small vent pipe should have been.   Why it was missing I don't know and the font looked to be an original.   I never repaired it but did buy some tine brass tubing for when I do fix it.   It was running smoothly when it want BANG and surprised a lot of us, mostly poor Terry.

[John Landstrom]

Whew !   I was worried someone was going to jail because their still blew up !   Alas it was just a pesky fan.   
 

Be careful loading it up for the drive home !
 

 

[Steven P Dempsey]

I had a copper lamp tank do the same thing, the seams split after it was stored near some chemical/cleaning agents.

I filled it with oil, thankfully no fire & it was outside!!!

[Steven P Dempsey]

note the vertical cracks running in the tank!

[Michael Rathberger]

Allow me to ask a stupid question. Would you always light on the opposite side of the vent tube? 

I take it Davis your sister in law is no longer interested in you demonstrating ANY of your toys? 

[Brent Rowell]

First of all, sorry I missed the obvious vent in the tin lamp photo--looked right at it and did not see it! So not sure the cause of this except perhaps a flaw in the burner's construction like a weak solder joint, internal corrosion, etc. That particular tank has many more soldered seams than an original and tin-plated steel is always subject to corrosion and old ones often have pinholes. I see stress cracks in Steven's lamp which is common in antique brass kerosene lamps. I repeat that you should never burn alcohol in a lamp like that one which is for kerosene. I thought that this is what happened to Terry's or Steve's--alcohol was used in a kero lamp; maybe Terry can clear up that story. The larger Lake Breeze floor fans were supplied with a small kerosene lamp and glass chimney--definitely not for alcohol. A friend tried burning alcohol in his kerosene lamp for a Jost fan with the same result--it popped at the seams. In spite of all that I've never heard of anyone getting injured or setting their house on fire. The fans are safe and effective if used correctly, but old lamps should be inspected carefully for leaks, flaws, etc. and repairs made or kept for decoration only. Michael, I don't think it matters on which side of the vent you light the lamp.

[Paul Michael]

1 hour ago, Brent Rowell said:

First of all, sorry I missed the obvious vent in the tin lamp photo--looked right at it and did not see it! So not sure the cause of this except perhaps a flaw in the burner's construction like a weak solder joint, internal corrosion, etc. That particular tank has many more soldered seams than an original and tin-plated steel is always subject to corrosion and old ones often have pinholes. I see stress cracks in Steven's lamp which is common in antique brass kerosene lamps. I repeat that you should never burn alcohol in a lamp like that one which is for kerosene. I thought that this is what happened to Terry's or Steve's--alcohol was used in a kero lamp; maybe Terry can clear up that story. The larger Lake Breeze floor fans were supplied with a small kerosene lamp and glass chimney--definitely not for alcohol. A friend tried burning alcohol in his kerosene lamp for a Jost fan with the same result--it popped at the seams. In spite of all that I've never heard of anyone getting injured or setting their house on fire. The fans are safe and effective if used correctly, but old lamps should be inspected carefully for leaks, flaws, etc. and repairs made or kept for decoration only. Michael, I don't think it matters on which side of the vent you light the lamp.

I appreciate your info - and yes it's EASY to miss visual info on screen. I'm often guilty of that myself, so apologies for calling it out... Anyway, yes, I figured that tank was a repro, based on the sloppy seams and tinning in general, but what I was after was whether or not the original ones had a seem at the top shoulder at all, and was hoping to see a photo of an original LakeBreeze steel burner for comparison, as I only have the copper.

[David Kilnapp]

Gentlemen:  Thank you for your comments. My tank does indeed have an air hole (see picture below). Ron Bethoney (New England Brass Refinishing) resoldered the bottom with silver solder to reinforce the seams so now we'll see although I'm inclined to follow Lane Shirey's advice and use a sterno. Ron Bethoney suggested using lamp oil which would not be as dangerous.

[Michael Rathberger]

Alcohol would burn clean, oil leaves a residue if I remember right, might not be good for the internals? Sterno would also burn pretty clean.

[David Kilnapp]

Perhaps, the next time I fill the tank, I'll first vent some of the alcohol vapor in the tank using a suction device, then put the cap back on and light it. What do you think? In any event, I sent Dave Dimitrion a facebook message but never got a response. Does anyone have his email address?

 

Update:  I put some alcohol in the tank and lit it (in my sink) and it didn't blow up!

Edited June 27, 2023 by David Kilnapp

[Brent Rowell]

Kerosene lamps require chimneys for draft, so you can't burn kero in this lamp without a smoky mess--safe, but nasty black smoke without a chimney. Thought I had a better photo, but here's an original tin-plated steel Lake Breeze alcohol burner. Except for the material, these were identical to the copper tanks. Note there are no seams on the top.

[Robert Grove]

8 hours ago, David Kilnapp said:

Perhaps, the next time I fill the tank, I'll first vent some of the alcohol vapor in the tank using a suction device, then put the cap back on and light it. What do you think? In any event, I sent Dave Dimitrion a facebook message but never got a response. Does anyone have his email address?

 

Update:  I put some alcohol in the tank and lit it (in my sink) and it didn't blow up!

David, Dave's email is djd5751@aol.com

[David Dimitrion]

heavy gauge copper and proper vent tube!

[David Kilnapp]

Those are just beautiful, Dave. Thanks for calling me.

[James Perkins]

I found a brass 16-inch 4-blade fan at an antique mall that I think may have gone on a Stovetop Sterling Engine Fan.  It has 4 rivets instead of 3.  I saw an auction listing with the same blade.