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All Brass Westy


Marc Sova
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Scored this little all brass AC/DC westy. Can you tell me much about it?
  -Date? I think it’s from the teens as best I can figure.
  -What would the original cord have been? Twisted cloth I’m assuming…black? Tan/gold???
  -What about the base… this has what looks like super thin (1/16”) Masonite or something. Surely this ain’t original?
  -Some of the wires on the cage are broke at the rear ring. 
   Not sure what I’m going to do with it…I kind of want to keep it in full patina. But part of me would like to polish it. Thoughts? If I decide to sell…ramifications of either? (If I polish it would be by hand only….and would probably have a little patina remaining in some corners etc). 

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Edited by Marc Sova
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1 hour ago, Marc Sova said:

Scored this little all brass AC/DC westy. Can you tell me much about it?
  -Date? I think it’s from the teens as best I can figure.
  -What would the original cord have been? Twisted cloth I’m assuming…black? Tan/gold???
  -What about the base… this has what looks like super thin (1/16”) Masonite or something. Surely this ain’t original?
  -Some of the wires on the cage are broke at the rear ring. 
   Not sure what I’m going to do with it…I kind of want to keep it in full patina. But part of me would like to polish it. Thoughts? If I decide to sell…ramifications of either? (If I polish it would be by hand only….and would probably have a little patina remaining in some corners etc). 

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Get two.  That way you can keep one original and one all shined up.

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I think base is original. Mine has same with a little bit of felt. Yours is an AC only fan per tag. They came in at least three finishes. Yours, blued, and copper flashed. Breaks in spokes are common. They're plentiful, finish as you like...

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108448A. Brushed Brass model. This included the trimmings (blade, guard, struts)

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Edited by Russ Huber
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1 hour ago, Michael Rathberger said:

I think base is original.

The base switch cover is original. 🙂

Edited by Russ Huber
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FWIW....you can have fun with those little guys. Most go to a buffing wheel with an all brass despite the style number finish. 🙂 The stained/varnished base. Base came from Hobby Lobby, the composite discs under the base I had cut to size at a trophy shop, the feet came from McMaster.  Enjoy your toy. 🙂

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Edited by Russ Huber
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Is black different from the blue we, or at least me,  see so often or did it just age to blue?

As for copper oxcide, only ever seen two. I found one in SB in ok shape and Darryl had a minty one in his collection...

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6 hours ago, Michael Rathberger said:

Is black different from the blue we, or at least me,  see so often or did it just age to blue?

As for copper oxcide, only ever seen two. I found one in SB in ok shape and Darryl had a minty one in his collection...

The blues I think is its own finish. Perhaps the copper oxide tarnished to sort of a blues or black look? I think what folks think as black is actually the blue. I just saw one for sale on marketplace and the guy has listed it (erroneously) as black. 

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14 hours ago, Michael Rathberger said:

I think base is original. Mine has same with a little bit of felt. Yours is an AC only fan per tag. They came in at least three finishes. Yours, blued, and copper flashed. Breaks in spokes are common. They're plentiful, finish as you like...

Hmmm….so why does mine have brushes if it’s ac only?????

Edited by Marc Sova
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13 hours ago, Russ Huber said:

108448A. Brushed Brass model. This included the trimmings (blade, guard, struts)

IMG_6073.thumb.jpeg.a8123e0c925234651134ab3d9cc0ca15 (1).jpeg

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Wow. Ok. Interesting. So brushed brass…I wonder what that look was. This just looks like polished that tarnished. I mean there is not really any brushes look to it. Also seems to have clear coat at least on the motor cause it’s not quite tarnished like the rest. So is mine AC only? It has brushes. But according to the catalogs you shared it’s only AC. 
   Thanks so much for all the great info. As usual. 

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7 hours ago, Michael Rathberger said:

Is black different from the blue we, or at least me, see so often or did it just age to blue?

The Westinghouse supply catalogue posted above dates 09. The 8" residence all brass was introduced in 08. This Westinghouse circular dates 1914. There is no mention of a gun blue finish. Somewhere between 09 and 14 Westinghouse added a 5th finish to the 8" drawn brass models, that being White Nickle. I think it is safe to state what one interprets as Gun Blue finish is actually faded Black Oxide.

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It appears I have an earlier Black Oxide model. My tag sports the "A" suffix. 

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1909

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1914

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44 minutes ago, Marc Sova said:

Ok. Interesting. So brushed brass…I wonder what that look was.

Your entire fan would sport a matt (dull) finish.  You could probably reproduce the finish with a fine steel wool. 

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1 hour ago, Marc Sova said:

Hmmm….so why does mine have brushes if it’s ac only?????

The tag states 60 cycles. It ain't me telling you it's the fan. That said, I have run some of mine in about 50VDC. They seem to do just fine. 

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38 minutes ago, Michael Rathberger said:

The tag states 60 cycles. It ain't me telling you it's the fan. That said, I have run some of mine in about 50VDC. They seem to do just fine. 

There are designated brushed AC fan motors from various manufacturers. Some may have universal motors compatible with either alternating or direct current, and they simply marketed it as an AC fan motor. However, depending on the armature winding, the fan may only be compatible with alternating current. 

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What I love about the hobby is people get to make their own decisions Russ. I'm just adding caution as I'm aware that almost any brush motor will run on DC. But you yourself taught me 10-15 years to start the DC voltage low on 60 cycle brushed AC tagged motors because it may just take off from the table and fly...

Edited by Michael Rathberger
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49 minutes ago, Michael Rathberger said:

What I love about the hobby is people get to make their own decisions Russ. I'm just adding caution as I'm aware that almost any brush motor will run on DC. But you yourself taught me 10-15 years to start the DC voltage low on 60 cycle brushed AC tagged motors because it may just take off from the table and fly...

 

2 hours ago, Russ Huber said:

There are designated brushed AC fan motors from various manufacturers. Some may have universal motors compatible with either alternating or direct current, and they simply marketed it as an AC fan motor. However, depending on the armature winding, the fan may only be compatible with alternating current. 

Gotcha. Yeah I’m not at all desirous of running it on DC. Was just curious. So when do you think my fan is from? ‘14 because it’s for the same model number as in the catalog? Or did those numbers not change much since 08??? 

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This example is proof just because they have a laminated stator and brushes, they will run equally as well on AC or DC. This fan was designed to run PROPERLY on alternating current. I tried DC once. On AC current it ran its best around 105-110 volts. On DC 40 volts was pushing it. It has a two-pole winding. So, the only logical reason it runs the way it does on either AC or DC is how the armature is wound. 

And BTW, whoever owns it to date, the individual pole windings had cotton/cloth sheathing. Hang on to it. 

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Edited by Russ Huber
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Ok so upon closer examination I DO see some evidence of the brushed finish!!!

    So….not that I’m going to polish it….but if I were to take some polish to it by hand (blue magic probably?) with microfiber…would this leave the brushes effect????

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You could try to remove the dirt with  WD40 and a soft rag. A lamp guy I know uses it to clean some lamp parts.

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On 1/31/2024 at 1:26 PM, Anthony Lindsey said:

Some pictures of a original fan

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So some of those picture makes it look like the nickel Finish rise mentioned above. Is that the original cord? Curious, what color cord came on these. I know the black and sometimes fade to a tan color making it look like it was originally tan or  gold.

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