Need Help With Dayton Type 67 Pivot Removal

[Russ Huber]

Is there anyone out there been there done that with removing the die cast pivot from the cast iron base on a 12" Dayton type 67? There is what appears to be a slotted pot metal plug that either threads into or is somehow inserted into the pivot. I have tried using a large flat head screwdriver to unthread it, but it won't budge. Anyone know the trick to get the pivot out. I don't want to get too aggressive with it being the pivot is die cast. 

[Russ Huber]

David Cherry, can you please help? I recall you restored a type 676 6 wing that would have this same pivot. Anyone? I don't want to risk fracturing it. 

[David A Cherry]

It’s just stuck. it’s supposed to come out if you don’t mind burning the paint you can use a torch. Can’t remember if it’s pop metal or not. If it is, you want to go easy on the heat years ago we had a situation where we used a prybar that was 8 feet long, and it was bending with two guys on the end of it that said we came up with an impact tool where the impact wrench and it slowly turned and impact it off. I say that to say this that there’s something about shock and impact so clean The screw slot soak everything in penetrating oil and then get a flathead screw attachment for a screwdriver impact screwdriver. The kind they sell at Home Depot with a battery. Mine is a Ryobi anyway the impacting vibrating pounding thousand times per second along with the penetrating oil maybe a little bit of heat, only heating the outside of the cast piece and not heating the screw. If anything put ice on the screw get everything cold and then heat the outside of the part that the screw is screwed into and hit it with the impact if that doesn’t work then take it back and shoot it with an AR 15. The damn thing should come out , you could always drill it out, but that’s what needs to happen. You can also put a small hole down through it and use an easy out at work we had an ELOCKS machine that would burn it out. hopefully this should get it though.

[Russ Huber]

6 minutes ago, David A Cherry said:

It’s just stuck. it’s supposed to come out if you don’t mind burning the paint you can use a torch. Can’t remember if it’s pop metal or not. If it is, you want to go easy on the heat years ago we had a situation where we used a prybar that was 8 feet long, and it was bending with two guys on the end of it that said we came up with an impact tool where the impact wrench and it slowly turned and impact it off. I say that to say this that there’s something about shock and impact so clean The screw slot soak everything in penetrating oil and then get a flathead screw attachment for a screwdriver impact screwdriver. The kind they sell at Home Depot with a battery. Mine is a Ryobi anyway the impacting vibrating pounding thousand times per second along with the penetrating oil maybe a little bit of heat, only heating the outside of the cast piece and not heating the screw. If anything put ice on the screw get everything cold and then heat the outside of the part that the screw is screwed into and hit it with the impact if that doesn’t work then take it back and shoot it with an AR 15. The damn thing should come out , you could always drill it out, but that’s what needs to happen. You can also put a small hole down through it and use an easy out at work we had an ELOCKS machine that would burn it out. hopefully this should get it though.

Thanks for chiming in. Is it threaded in, or is it pressed into the pivot? The plug is pot metal.  I have done heat, it is one stubborn SOB.

Edited June 15, 2024 by Russ Huber

[Russ Huber]

6 hours ago, David A Cherry said:

It’s just stuck. it’s supposed to come out if you don’t mind burning the paint you can use a torch. Can’t remember if it’s pop metal or not. If it is, you want to go easy on the heat years ago we had a situation where we used a prybar that was 8 feet long, and it was bending with two guys on the end of it that said we came up with an impact tool where the impact wrench and it slowly turned and impact it off. I say that to say this that there’s something about shock and impact so clean The screw slot soak everything in penetrating oil and then get a flathead screw attachment for a screwdriver impact screwdriver. The kind they sell at Home Depot with a battery. Mine is a Ryobi anyway the impacting vibrating pounding thousand times per second along with the penetrating oil maybe a little bit of heat, only heating the outside of the cast piece and not heating the screw. If anything put ice on the screw get everything cold and then heat the outside of the part that the screw is screwed into and hit it with the impact if that doesn’t work then take it back and shoot it with an AR 15. The damn thing should come out , you could always drill it out, but that’s what needs to happen. You can also put a small hole down through it and use an easy out at work we had an ELOCKS machine that would burn it out. hopefully this should get it though.

 

6 hours ago, Russ Huber said:

Thanks for chiming in. Is it threaded in, or is it pressed into the pivot? The plug is pot metal.  I have done heat, it is one stubborn SOB.

I called David using the directory and got his phone answering service earlier today. I asked on David's answering service if the plug had threads or not being he did not respond here? I figured he would know based on his previous Dayton 6 wing 676 restoration. I have received no call back or answer here from David as to what his Dayton pivot plug was, that being threaded in, or pressed into the pivot. 

Has ANYONE ever restored one of these fans and successfully removed the pivot? If so, you should know whether the slotted plug seen in the image was threaded or pressed in the pivot. This is pot metal I am dealing with; I just can't go banging and drilling on it unless I know what I am dealing with. That die cast plug keeps the pivot centered in place. This pivot is not the same as Seth Anderson's reproductions. If I wreck it, not good.

I and a friend tried together today heating the slotted plug with a propane torch. One held the base/pivot and the other used a large flat head screwdriver with wrench hex and tried to turn that slotted plug. It wouldn't budge. 

[David A Cherry]

Sorry for not returning your call.. it is 100% threaded. The plug is threaded and not pot metal it is made of steel or possibly cast-iron. Can’t remember ..There is something called static friction and it can be really strong.. I think you will need all three penetrating oil, soaking overnight, followed by heat and an impact driver. it’s not large impacts. It’s thousands of little tiny impacts. I know it’s pop metal all the daytons necks were pop metal from that time period.. call me back if you wish to talk further, but I think this should work.. there’s a possibility that the threads are filled with paint so that will need to be cleaned out. If you want to be safe because of the pop metal neck, you will need to drill it out, but there you will need to be on your game because you don’t want the drill to walk. This should safely remove it if done properly with an easy out, I can see your dilemma and not wanting to risk damaging the neck there’s always not removing it and working with what you have. No risk no reward but then again no risk no risk.. Maybe it’s best to just not take the risk and do the best you can with it being together.. 100 year old pot metal can be very brittle.. good luck call me. 513-251-7017.  I am guaranteed to answer the phone between 10 PM and 1 o’clock in the morning.. I am a night owl

Edited June 17, 2024 by David A Cherry

[Russ Huber]

46 minutes ago, David A Cherry said:

Sorry for not returning your call.. it is 100% threaded. The plug is threaded and not pot metal it is made of steel or possibly cast-iron.

David and I just finished with phone discussion. There is an outside threaded slotted steel disc with a wavy compression washer behind it that compresses against the slotted pot metal plug. After our discussion it remains UNDETERMINED what holds the slotted pot metal plug into the die cast pivot. 

IF ANYONE HAS EVER HAD THIS DAYTON MODEL AND REMOVED THE PIVOT FROM THE BASE, PLEASE EDUCATE THE REST OF US HOW YOU DID IT.