Decorative motifs on Edison fan

[Dan Nguyen]

I noticed that Edison battery fans use many different styles of decorative motifs on fans, some with Edison's signature, some with only decorative motifs, no signature.  
And the decorative motifs are also quite diverse, not the same on all fans.  

I wonder, what does that difference mean?  Are the decorations related to the year the fan was produced?  

Hope there's an expert here to explain that.  Thank!

 

[David A Cherry]

Interesting question.. more than likely it’s just an artist expression with different painters doing their thing.. My guess is that the fancier ones are the older ones.. Like anything else they got simpler to speed up production and save money.. 

[John Trier]

Here's a motif I've never seen before.   It was at a flee market for around 7K.  I can't remember now but I shared this image with some afca'ers and someone thought it was a European export version.   Imagine this image rotated 90 degrees.   

 

 

[Dan Nguyen]

[Jeff Lumsden]

If there were variations for the fans, were there variations for the motors also?

 

 

[Jim Henderson]

Emerson tripods followed a similar path. By 1900 the only "painting " was two simple gold stripes around the circumference of the motor.

[Jim Kovar]

3 hours ago, John Trier said:

Imagine this image rotated 90 degrees.

 

OK, John,...
...an Edison ceiling fan?  

[Steve Rockwell]

          Dan, I am not that expert you seek--- and by the way of nothing else, how are you doing with that three-phase fan?--- but I want to relate something I was told some years ago by an expert, possibly not an expert on Edison fans but definitely an expert on Edison. Showing me his fan, he stated that only the first 500 or so fans carried the Edison signature. Since being told that, I've seen many photos of course, and it seems that, even within this Forum, that pics have suggested the statement might not be accurate... and, considering that Edison's signature continued to be plastered everywhere, it lends a bit of skepticism to the idea... However, there are Edison fans to be seen which do not display the signature, so perhaps that's another related subject to factor. I too have tried to examine decorative patterns on fans by Edison and by Holtzer-Cabot to link them with some timeline, and have failed to conclude anything on the subject...   I hope this thread leads to an answer to your question, but I'm unable to assist.....

       Compare the following to your second image........

Edited October 5, 2022 by Steve Rockwell

[Russ Huber]

I find it amazing the detail work of the late 19th century artisans. I know a sign painter in my area in his 70s and still doing it. He is good with his camel hair brushes, but I have never seen him do the fine line work like these relics sport.

[Steve Cunningham]

Interesting topic Dan. My best guess is the motors were sent to a striping room. Each striper (probably women) did their own version.

[Jim Kovar]

2 hours ago, Russ Huber said:

...detail work of the late 19th century artisans.

Now, look what the
    21st century "artisans"
        are doing...     Argh! 

[Mark Stillman]

I was fortunate enough to find one with a fairly busy paint job.....

[John Trier]

How about an early Iron Clad?

 

[Dan Nguyen]

Thank you!
All the information is very rich and interesting!
I believe they don't paint the motifs manually, maybe the manufacturers used the decal for quick mass production.
And I believe the decorative motifs are related to different stages of production. That could be a way to differentiate the fan's year of production.

[Jeff Lumsden]

I'm pretty sure they were hand-painted.  The repeated design motifs aren't the same on the same fan.  My fan below has 7 of the circle/diamond motif and all seven are slightly different from each other. 

Edited October 6, 2022 by Jeff Lumsden

[Paul Michael]

On 10/4/2022 at 11:29 PM, Dan Nguyen said:

I noticed that Edison battery fans use many different styles of decorative motifs on fans, some with Edison's signature, some with only decorative motifs, no signature.  
And the decorative motifs are also quite diverse, not the same on all fans.  

I wonder, what does that difference mean?  Are the decorations related to the year the fan was produced?  

Hope there's an expert here to explain that.  Thank!

 

Dan - I've noticed an interesting detail about dating Edison Fans in addition the the progression of the decoration... Look carefully at your last photo! What year is that publication from? I suspect it is earlier than all your other photos... (-; 

[Gary Hagan]

https://sketchfab.com/3d-models/retro-ventilator-287781cfb81144ccb632fc2e2288d8a4

[Paul Michael]

@Gary Hagan, please show us this one! (From your prior post):
 

Edited September 17, 2023 by Paul Michael
typo

[Curt Davis]

I agree that they were hand painted.  No two are exactly the same and even on the same fan there are subtle differences in the designs.  So this is not possible with a decal. The "Thomas A. Edison" signature is a trademark that was filed in 1900 but used before that in 1899 on phonographs for sure.  So any fans w/o that signature are likely prior to 1899. 

Rene Rondeau did an excellent article after extensive research on the Edison Iron Clad and I have attached the PDF here.  I believe his observations on the evolution of the motifs, the nameplates, and the trademark signature are applicable to the C-frames as well. 

@John Trier  I recognize the foot, the hardwood floor, and the antique microscope case in your iron clad pic  🙂  Oh yeah and the fan also  😃

Rondou_APS-19-6.pdf

 

[John Trier]

21 hours ago, Curt Davis said:

I agree that they were hand painted.  No two are exactly the same and even on the same fan there are subtle differences in the designs.  So this is not possible with a decal. The "Thomas A. Edison" signature is a trademark that was filed in 1900 but used before that in 1899 on phonographs for sure.  So any fans w/o that signature are likely prior to 1899. 

Rene Rondeau did an excellent article after extensive research on the Edison Iron Clad and I have attached the PDF here.  I believe his observations on the evolution of the motifs, the nameplates, and the trademark signature are applicable to the C-frames as well. 

@John Trier  I recognize the foot, the hardwood floor, and the antique microscope case in your iron clad pic  🙂  Oh yeah and the fan also  😃

Rondou_APS-19-6.pdf 5.65 MB · 9 downloads

 

That was quite a day and tour of Loyd's stuff.   It was just everywhere (as you know).  Towards the end of the day, I looked right at Loyd and said, "Loyd, what are you doing".   He knew what I meant, smiled at me and had a ready answer, "This is my way of getting back at my kids".   All of us have this problem.    

[Curt Davis]

@John Trier  10 or 11 auctions so far.  I have lost count.  All the political, military, and phonograph stuff is gone.  Most of the "GM" (general merchandise) is gone but lots of odds and ends.  Fans are still a work in progress but we hope to finish by 2024.  We have some important musical instruments that are next on the list to deal with. I have dozens of boxes of early and rare sheet music, but it is not worth much except for a few key items.

My brother was present for this conversation you described above and his response to your question is classic JLD. But I am not quite sure (?) what he was getting back at us since we spent our formative years going to every flea market, auction, collector's meeting, farm, barn, outhouse, and dog house in a four state area helping JLD ply his craft. 

He did what he had to do to scratch out a living and still support his collecting "hobbies" while providing for our mother's long-term care in the only way he knew how.  We learned many life lessons growing up this way, and I draw upon these experiences all the time and also share the many stories with his two grandsons so they have a deeper appreciation of hard work, effort, and perseverance.

When you are ready to deal with your "problem" send me a DM.  The Davis brothers are are forming an antique liquidation company specializing in antique fans, phonographs, and general merchandise!  🙂

[John Trier]

@Curt Davis  How many of us will leave our lifetime of collecting to our wives or family to dispose of?   I’m guessing almost all of us since most of us are men and will croak off before our wives.   Loyd was a hoot, his comment about getting back at his kids was funny and one we could all say.  When I was around him, he was always friendly towards me.  But as you say, this is how he put food on the table.   I have one good fan I got from Loyd and I was the underbidder on the eBay auction where it sold.  The winner was on the fence and Loyd sort of talked him out of it knowing I would buy it.  That meant a lot it me.

Looking forward to your auctions.  Hope this is ok, but here’s the last couple of pictures I took that day of his civil war era musical instruments he really liked. Sadly Loyd passed away a few months later.  


 

Edited April 9, 2023 by John Trier

[Curt Davis]

@John Trier  Great pics.  Thanks for posting.  Those instruments above and many others are next on the list to liquidate after fans and some miscellaneous early electrical (non-fan) stuff.

[Paul Michael]

On 4/7/2023 at 9:20 AM, Paul Michael said:

Gary, please show us this one! (From your prior post):
 

Bump! @Gary Hagan, could you please share the 'early rare Edison Catalog' you modeled this from? Many thanks!

[Curt Davis]

Here are some pics of an early C-Frame (ca. 1895) with cast brass "Edison Mfg. Co." tag and 6-pole motor.  Later C-frames had 12-pole motors and have a stamped brass tag (usually with a serial number) and even later the Thomas A Edison signature was added also.