Mark Behrend Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 (edited) James, have you tried plugging it in or is the head wire in that bad of shape. If it does work, simply follow each wire and mark them before you snip it off. I will use small colored zip ties, diff color tape, whatever. If the head wire is not there, pull out the stator and test the ohms. If there is no response from your readings, the stator has a possible short or bad connection. Before any resto I would try and make sure it works prior before tearing it apart. These are nice fans and fairly easy to work on after your first attempt. Good luck, I started with the same model Emerson I got from my parents house. Edited April 4 by Mark Behrend 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 7 Author Share Posted April 7 The head wire was broken in 2 places all the way through. I now think I understand how to check the 3 wires on stator for resistance? I did remove the speed switch to clean it up and verify its condition. I'll test the stator before removing it from the head if it works? This fan will need to be stripped and painted as I don't believe it can polish up (too much paint missing)? The brass blades are fine but the threaded mount spins where it connects to the 4 way blade mount? It looks like someone tried to pry the center compression piece and chipped it in 3 places making that connection slip? I did remove the blade assy. from the motor threads and removed the cage and mounts. I hope there is a way to repair the center mount, but I'm guessing it will need welding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Newcity Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 12 hours ago, James Gaspard said: The head wire was broken in 2 places all the way through. I now think I understand how to check the 3 wires on stator for resistance? I did remove the speed switch to clean it up and verify its condition. I'll test the stator before removing it from the head if it works? This fan will need to be stripped and painted as I don't believe it can polish up (too much paint missing)? The brass blades are fine but the threaded mount spins where it connects to the 4 way blade mount? It looks like someone tried to pry the center compression piece and chipped it in 3 places making that connection slip? I did remove the blade assy. from the motor threads and removed the cage and mounts. I hope there is a way to repair the center mount, but I'm guessing it will need welding? So glad to see that you are using the multimeter. I was going to mention to you that there are a lot of multimeter tutorials on Utube. If you don't get your blade hub repaired satisfactorily, let me know. I can probably come up with a blade assembly that would cost you no more than shipping cost. I could throw in a head wire also. Let us know if there are any parts you may need. Please ask questions as you go, and keep us posted. I've restored a few 29646's and am always willing to share info. And by the way, as so many have shared with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 7 Author Share Posted April 7 Thank you Newcity, I may have to get another blade hub if this can't be welded? A jeweler said it could be braised with an oxy torch with no distortion to the hub and easily cleaned up for painting? Mine is still attached but it slips turning freely. Do you feel the blades will need to be removed with the rivets to repair and refinish the assembly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 7 Author Share Posted April 7 Do you think all I'll need is the hub and blade mounts? I read & watched several guys here document they're replacing brass rivets while refinishing the blade assy. , but it doesn't look easy?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 7 Author Share Posted April 7 What is the proper length of the AC cord in 1930 model 29646? Was the cord twisted cloth covered or was it cloth covered 18 ga. like the head wire but only 2 wires? What plug style is correct for a 1930? I've gotten the head wire already but need to order the correct AC cord and plug? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Newcity Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 1 hour ago, James Gaspard said: Do you think all I'll need is the hub and blade mounts? I read & watched several guys here document they're replacing brass rivets while refinishing the blade assy. , but it doesn't look easy?? Once you have the special tools, the rivets, and know the procedure, it becomes easier. I did not remove the blades on my first restorations. Later on I acquired the tools and taught myself. Then I hauled my equipment to fan meets and taught others how to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Newcity Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 1 hour ago, James Gaspard said: Thank you Newcity, I may have to get another blade hub if this can't be welded? A jeweler said it could be braised with an oxy torch with no distortion to the hub and easily cleaned up for painting? Mine is still attached but it slips turning freely. Do you feel the blades will need to be removed with the rivets to repair and refinish the assembly? If I had a choice of repairing the abused hub or replacing it with a complete blade assembly, I would go with the replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Huber Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 (edited) WoW, James! You lucky dog! You are getting one on one instruction with the Dr. Newcity, director of the Emerson Reasearch facility in Fort Smith, Arkansas. 🙂 Psssssssssssst.....I checked my blade box and no spare 12" Emerson blade. They are fairly abundant out there yet, so be patient. Edited April 7 by Russ Huber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Newcity Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 23 minutes ago, Russ Huber said: WoW, James! You lucky dog! You are getting one on one instruction with the Dr. Newcity, director of the Emerson Reasearch facility in Fort Smith, Arkansas. 🙂 Psssssssssssst.....I checked my blade box and no spare 12" Emerson blade. They are fairly abundant out there yet, so be patient. I ready offered him one Russ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Huber Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 35 minutes ago, Thomas Newcity said: I already offered him one Russ. What a guy, what a team! Tom and Shadow, the dynamic duo. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 10 Author Share Posted April 10 On 4/7/2024 at 4:08 PM, Thomas Newcity said: I ready offered him one Russ. I'm hoping you can tell me again about the offer on a fan hub for the 29646? I've tried looking back for that offer but can't find it? My threaded part that screws onto the rotor is fine on the inside threaded part but on the front end where it attaches to the blade assy., the round compression connection looks to be picked or pried at making it slip at that connection. My brass blades look fine but I'm not thinking this loose connection in the hub will work if tested?? Thinking if I can't affored a replacement, I'll look at having it mig welded and try to clean up the weld before painting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 10 Author Share Posted April 10 The problem on my blade assembly is where the hub that screws onto the rotor attaches to the spider? The spider has a round connection in the spider center with pressed over metal to sinch that connection. The metal that is crushed over has pieces missing with that connection being able to slip it place? I'll try to post a photo ASAP. I'm not sure if arc welding can secure the connection? I may need to find another hub and spider to rivet my blades to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 10 Author Share Posted April 10 On 4/7/2024 at 10:29 AM, Thomas Newcity said: So glad to see that you are using the multimeter. I was going to mention to you that there are a lot of multimeter tutorials on Utube. If you don't get your blade hub repaired satisfactorily, let me know. I can probably come up with a blade assembly that would cost you no more than shipping cost. I could throw in a head wire also. Let us know if there are any parts you may need. Please ask questions as you go, and keep us posted. I've restored a few 29646's and am always willing to share info. And by the way, as so many have shared with me. I talked with someone local that said arc or mid welding would possibly throw the spider and hub out of balance? I was told that this spider and hub fit many Emerson blade assemblies and I could rivet my polished and lacquered blades on to the replacement hub assy.? I've tried looking for these parts but only found them with blades attached and needing to be refinished, and the cost was high. Let me know if I'm thinking of this right/correct? It seemed that if a mig weld or even a laser weld (like jewelers use) would be less intrusive to throw it out of balance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Ray Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 I held a blade riveting seminar at Fan Fair last year. Here's the tools you'll need to rivet the blades to the hub: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Campbell Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 (edited) You should post a pic of the hub. There is a process in which a socket for wrench socket set can be placed over ring and hammered down by recrimping and stopping the sometimes seen loose spider on hub. Welding should not be considered. Somewhere you said something about previous prying so post a pic and maybe give another approach Edited April 11 by Chris Campbell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Ray Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 I've used both Chris's suggestion for recrimping with a socket as well as using Loctite and letting the liquid wick into the joint to lock it in place. Had a Silver Swan pedestal where the crimp came loose. I didn't want to scratch the good original finish and used just Loctite on the slipping joint. Worked great! And that's a fan I run often and it hasn't let loose yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 11 Author Share Posted April 11 I did say that it looks to me that someone at some point tried to pry the hub from the spider causing several pieces to chip off of the circle that is crimped to secure the hub to the spider? I can't imagine what else could cause the missing pieces? The blade assembly was removed by holding the rotor from the rear while turning the hub assy. clockwise by me until it separated. My cage is not damaged, making me think someone attempted some other method to remove the blade assy. before I got the fan? IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 11 Author Share Posted April 11 14 hours ago, Chris Campbell said: You should post a pic of the hub. There is a process in which a socket for wrench socket set can be placed over ring and hammered down by recrimping and stopping the sometimes seen loose spider on hub. Welding should not be considered. Somewhere you said something about previous prying so post a pic and maybe give another approach I've had no luck searching for the socket being used to pound/sinch down the flared hub end that passes thru the spiders center hole on the blade assy.? I'm thinking your saying to locate a socket wrench that is proper sized to peen the remaining pieces of the hub end down to sinch that connection. Am I going to use "LOCTITE" after peening to help secure the grip? LocTite doesn't seam like a very strong bond on a loose connection like mine? My spider is spinning freely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Campbell Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 17 minutes ago, James Gaspard said: I've had no luck searching for the socket being used to pound/sinch down the flared hub end that passes thru the spiders center hole on the blade assy.? I'm thinking your saying to locate a socket wrench that is proper sized to peen the remaining pieces of the hub end down to sinch that connection. Am I going to use "LOCTITE" after peening to help secure the grip? LocTite doesn't seam like a very strong bond on a loose connection like mine? My spider is spinning freely. Just going off past techniques. Without a pic unsure how repairable situation is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 11 Author Share Posted April 11 Just now, Chris Campbell said: Just going off past techniques. Without a pic unsure how repairable situation is I will try to post a photo on the damaged connection? Thanks for responding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 12 Author Share Posted April 12 Hello Chris, I tried putting the open/threaded end of hub on a pine board on cement floor with spider facing upward. I put a heavy socket that fit well on the hub end and hit it 6 times with a 2 lbs. hammer. Every hit made it tighter with inspection. I finally stopped at 6 as it feels very strong and stable. With so many pieces of the crushed rolled over part missing, I'm thinking it will have to be brazed with either oxy/gas or mig to fill in thos 4 missing spots that are each 3/16" wide? The electric mig feels like the most reliable fix with less chance if failure/cracking? I'm still working on posting a photo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 12 Author Share Posted April 12 There are 4 missing pieces 3/16" wide and 1 is 1/8" wide. I'm thinking that these missing pieces of the crush ring are going to cause a failure if the missing pieces aren't replaced with a melted bead? An electric weld seems like the better method to prevent failure? The blade assembly is very stiff a stable after peening it with a socket! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 13 Author Share Posted April 13 On 3/23/2024 at 2:51 PM, Steve Sherwood said: An Emerson 29646 should have only 3 wires coming from the stator. My mistake when saying "4 wires" when in fact there are 3 wires coming of my stator. Thanks, and the confusion was me. Again, Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Gaspard Posted April 13 Author Share Posted April 13 Does anyone have a hub and spider for replacement to my Emerson 29646 fan and brass blades? I've tried searching for a replacement online but I'm only finding complete 29646 12" fan assemblies that cost more than I'm thinking a complete non running fan would cost? My hub and spider need repair or replacement. I'd like to post a photo of the failed chipped connection of my hub to the spider but I'm not understanding the photo posting methods? I really need a hub and spider, and someone said this hub & spider are same for many other Emerson fans of this 1922 thru 36 time? Not sure if that's true but would like to know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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